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24/25 Wednesday transfer thread


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Surprised that Dawson has been offered another contract but if we'd stuck him on the bye bye list then we'd have been left with no first team keeper 

Until we find a new one, that is

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Posted (edited)

Genuinely interested to see where Fletcher goes next good subs bench with the new contract offers 👍 not all of them 

See who else stays Smith probably go Wilks hopefully, not sure about iky (can’t spell it)

Edited by HappyOwl
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Theman said:

My maths isn’t great but I make that , if everyone accepts, a squad of 19. Some under contract may leave, some offered contracts may not stay. Plenty of scope for DR to put his stamp on things 👍

Happy to be corrected but I get that to 17, with Charles and Cadamarteri not counting towards squad numbers (I think) along with one or two other youngsters from the academy. You'd think we have a first choice goalkeeper incoming so that'd be 18. We're allowed 25 aren't we? So he could bring in another 7 players (goalie would be 8)

  1. Dawson?
  2. Palmer
  3. Diaby
  4. Iorfa?
  5. Valentin
  6. Bernard?
  7. Ihiekwe
  8. Famewo
  9. Vaulks?
  10. Bannan?
  11. Johnson
  12. Windass?
  13. Wilks
  14. Paterson
  15. Smith
  16. Gassama
  17. Musaba

Still some if and buts though, depends on those offered new terms accepting and staying and of course nobody else leaving.

Great starting point though.

Edited by Alan Finney
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4 hours ago, HoylandOwl said:

Surprised about taking the option on Neymarv, he did VERY well by and large under DR. But didn't think we'd keep him around due to his age. 

Deserves it, IMO. Been largely excellent since he got back. 

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3 hours ago, Chelters said:

Had to laugh at a comment on X from someone who wasn’t impressed with the list :  “hard to believe they’re Rohl’s choices”.

The implication is pretty clear and will be the flavour of the summer for some of our fans : good signings are down to Rohl, crap signings are Chansiri’s fault.

You're right: utterly predictable.  

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41 minutes ago, Owling_Wolf said:

What's he done to you?  

Nowt

Can't see him wanting to be a second choice at our place and the mini pigs will be needing a keeper, coupled with he won't have to uproot his family 

I like the bloke and would be happy for him to stay btw

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Posted (edited)

I think Dawson probably takes the same route as Wildsmith from here. But you’d imagine we need 7-10 players even if most of these players stick around and perhaps Wilks struggles to make the 25 man list or others move on unexpectedly. So had we gone to clear the decks further it would be detrimental as there needs to be a core to build on. Plenty of scope to get some younger legs in the team and hopefully someone like Phuti challenges Valentin as the 3-4-3 type formation would suit them both. 

Edited by TheExile
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Alan Finney said:

Happy to be corrected but I get that to 17, with Charles and Cadamarteri not counting towards squad numbers (I think) along with one or two other youngsters from the academy. You'd think we have a first choice goalkeeper incoming so that'd be 18. We're allowed 25 aren't we? So he could bring in another 7 players (goalie would be 😎

  1. Dawson?
  2. Palmer
  3. Diaby
  4. Iorfa?
  5. Valentin
  6. Bernard?
  7. Ihiekwe
  8. Famewo
  9. Vaulks?
  10. Bannan?
  11. Johnson
  12. Windass?
  13. Wilks
  14. Paterson
  15. Smith
  16. Gassama
  17. Musaba

Still some if and buts though, depends on those offered new terms accepting and staying and of course nobody else leaving.

Great starting point though.

I’m including Charles and Cadamarteri in the 19 👍

Edited by Theman
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8 minutes ago, Theman said:

I’m including Charles and Cadamarteri in the 19 👍

Thought so, I'd left them out as we also have Siqueira, Maltby and Reed who also show up on the OS as first team players. I'm just waiting for @Tylluanto come along and tell us exactly when the younger players have to be included in the main 25 squad numbers, possibly in the season/year they turn 21 maybe.

I expect some of them will be going out on loan as well, especially the 2 lads you mention.

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36 minutes ago, Alan Finney said:

Thought so, I'd left them out as we also have Siqueira, Maltby and Reed who also show up on the OS as first team players. I'm just waiting for @Tylluanto come along and tell us exactly when the younger players have to be included in the main 25 squad numbers, possibly in the season/year they turn 21 maybe.

I expect some of them will be going out on loan as well, especially the 2 lads you mention.

Gassama is only 20 so doesn't count.

It's 21 on January 1st before the start of the season.

So we have 16 taking up squad places.

5 loans who will all take up a place regardless of age, leaving only 4 places for permanent players.

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5 minutes ago, Tewksbury said:

Gassama is only 20 so doesn't count.

It's 21 on January 1st before the start of the season.

So we have 16 taking up squad places.

5 loans who will all take up a place regardless of age, leaving only 4 places for permanent players.

Thanks for that, although I thought Gassama did count because we didn't bring him through the academy. It's a bit confusing all this stuff.

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Just now, Alan Finney said:

Thanks for that, although I thought Gassama did count because we didn't bring him through the academy. It's a bit confusing all this stuff.

That's home grown, an entirely different metric.

It gets a bit confusing because u21 loans and prem academy players didn't count in L1, but all loans count in the Champ, so Beadle takes up a spot even though he's 19.

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6 hours ago, Reesh said:

Based on what? Rohl has rewarded those who did Well for him with new deals but with enough scope to improve with the spaces in the squad.

1. Bonuses are there for rewards, not contracts.

2. DR said that his release list will be based on the market and who he thinks he can get in to replace them.

3. Johnson is on there. DR has spent half the season trying ro replace him with a proper LB, why would we keep him?

4. This takes us to 16 squad places filled. We will use 5 for loans. That leaves only 4 spots for permanent long term players. As opposed to 8 players who will be over 30 at this time next season.

Not really going to rebuild the team in his own image with 4 players. Say we get Ugbo, Poveda and McGuire, that leaves 1 player, when we really need long term replacements at CM and LB on top of that at least.

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1 minute ago, Tewksbury said:

That's home grown, an entirely different metric.

It gets a bit confusing because u21 loans and prem academy players didn't count in L1, but all loans count in the Champ, so Beadle takes up a spot even though he's 19.

FFS, it gets worse 😂😂😂. Thanks for that. So, if 20 on 1st January they don't count. If we have them on loan from an English club they do count even if they're under 21 on the 1st January. FFS, I think I'd be better just asking one of you lot when it crops up again. I am surprised though that we're allowed to sign permanent players, especially from abroad and they get a free pass but hey ho, watch this space, there'll be more questions to come.😂

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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Tewksbury said:

This takes us to 16 squad places filled. We will use 5 for loans. That leaves only 4 spots for permanent long term players. As opposed to 8 players who will be over 30 at this time next season.

That's assuming all those offered a contract sign and Johnson and Paterson are included in the squad, nevermind playing. 

I think exercising both contract extensions is a bit of shrewd business. Just because they've re-signed doesn't mean they're both still here in September. In Johnson's case now we've binned James and Delgado and Pederson has gone back he's the only recognised first team left wing back. Hopefully Sam Reed kicks on and pushes him for the place or someone else comes in to challenge for the spot. 

Edited by Tylluan
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Why the presumption that we will have 5 loan players leaving only 4 permanent spots ? 

Because you could have no loan players and 9 permanent players meaning very much Rohl could shape a side to his liking

 

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7 hours ago, Tewksbury said:

1. Bonuses are there for rewards, not contracts.

2. DR said that his release list will be based on the market and who he thinks he can get in to replace them.

3. Johnson is on there. DR has spent half the season trying ro replace him with a proper LB, why would we keep him?

4. This takes us to 16 squad places filled. We will use 5 for loans. That leaves only 4 spots for permanent long term players. As opposed to 8 players who will be over 30 at this time next season.

Not really going to rebuild the team in his own image with 4 players. Say we get Ugbo, Poveda and McGuire, that leaves 1 player, when we really need long term replacements at CM and LB on top of that at least.

Perhaps point 2 is pertinent, that they are not seeing vastly better options out there.

Within our budget and wage structure

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I can’t see why there’s so much negativity on the retained list, even if it is mainly from one person.

Nine empty squad places, plus maybe two more if new contracts aren’t accepted. And we’ve retained (if they sign up) the basis of the side that did will last season.

Bringing back Beadle, Poveda and Ugbo (or equivalent) that helped transform the team in the latter half of the season leaves six or more spaces for new additions. If you think these will be filled with like for like replacements for Hendrick and Fletcher and James, fair enough, panic, but I’m expecting at least half of them to be regular starters. The others will be strong contenders.
 

First game of the season and over half the team will be Rohl signings and most of the others will be players that Rohl has improved considerably from Xisco’s days (Valentin, Musaba). And a pre season together: the team will be Rohl’s, playing how he wants it to.

Shit might be around the corner, but now is the time for a bit of positivity.

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21 minutes ago, M42Owl said:

I can’t see why there’s so much negativity on the retained list, even if it is mainly from one person.

Nine empty squad places, plus maybe two more if new contracts aren’t accepted. And we’ve retained (if they sign up) the basis of the side that did will last season.

Bringing back Beadle, Poveda and Ugbo (or equivalent) that helped transform the team in the latter half of the season leaves six or more spaces for new additions. If you think these will be filled with like for like replacements for Hendrick and Fletcher and James, fair enough, panic, but I’m expecting at least half of them to be regular starters. The others will be strong contenders.
 

First game of the season and over half the team will be Rohl signings and most of the others will be players that Rohl has improved considerably from Xisco’s days (Valentin, Musaba). And a pre season together: the team will be Rohl’s, playing how he wants it to.

Shit might be around the corner, but now is the time for a bit of positivity.

I agree. 
 

There is also the possibility that Wilks and others will leave, or not make the squad if they choose to stay. 
 

One or two of the players we sign might be under 20. 
 

We are not restricted at all by resigning the ones to whom contracts have been offered. There’s loads of scope to vastly improve the squad. 

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Remember DR expressing his amazement earlier in the season that we had so many contracts ending at the same time. 
If you want to change that cycle, you’ve got to retain a core squad whilst adding to it. I think we’ve just got used to the out with the old… in with the new approach every summer, so now a bit of continuity seems strange!

DR’s January window showed him bringing in players to start, not fill squad places, so I’m expecting the same this summer. There’s no misplaced loyalty to anyone and DRs already shown he’s happy to bench or leave out some of the old guard. 

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There is always a balance between continuity and fresh faces. 

Let's not pretend that every new signing, even with the data due diligence undertaken these days will fit in. 

The retained players did perform OK, some will argue they produced play off level capabilities, I personally think it overstates a tad, but its about adding quality not quantity for me. And options because the one thing Rohl showed is the ability to go different styles as required

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11 hours ago, Tewksbury said:

1. Bonuses are there for rewards, not contracts.

2. DR said that his release list will be based on the market and who he thinks he can get in to replace them.

3. Johnson is on there. DR has spent half the season trying ro replace him with a proper LB, why would we keep him?

4. This takes us to 16 squad places filled. We will use 5 for loans. That leaves only 4 spots for permanent long term players. As opposed to 8 players who will be over 30 at this time next season.

Not really going to rebuild the team in his own image with 4 players. Say we get Ugbo, Poveda and McGuire, that leaves 1 player, when we really need long term replacements at CM and LB on top of that at least.

What exactly constitutes ‘building a team in his own image’? 

We’ve already seen him win over this group of players and get them believing in ‘his’ image. Like others have pointed out, he’s not sentimental, he’s pragmatic. If you don’t do the work, you won’t be in the squad. 

And because he’s pragmatic he also knows he needs a base to build up from. A core group that he’s already worked with.

Having a clear out and bringing in all new faces might be ‘exciting’ to fans but it’s not going to make DR’s job necessarily easier. We’ve heard from a lot of players how tight knit that dressing room is. How ‘the great escape’ will have fostered trust and belief in each other in that core group.

And besides it’s not a given all those offered contracts, or still on a deal, will be here come the start of the season. This list is just the very first step. And it’s sensible, no frills, exactly the type of step a good manager would take.

Yours is just quite a pessimistic take imo. And I know that comes with the territory being Wednesday fans. But it seems a little unnecessary at this stage. 

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This is DR's first 'proper' (Summer) transfer window anywhere as the boss.  That might make him slightly more cautious than otherwise.  Yes, he's got bags of experience around him, I'm sure he'll use it, but "The buck stops here" as they say. 

The good news is that he gets his own first 'real' pre-season too. 

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7 hours ago, mkowl said:

Why the presumption that we will have 5 loan players leaving only 4 permanent spots ? 

Because you could have no loan players and 9 permanent players meaning very much Rohl could shape a side to his liking

 

I suppose we could also sign a whole range of u21 players who are quality and don’t count toward the total

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By underwhelming, I mean exactly that.

I still think we'll be solidly midtable, pushing top half, bit I also think that you could let most of them go and still be in the same position, but not needing to make the same decision next year. Keeping them all on is very much kicking the can down the road, we'll just be in the same situation next season. Why not take the hit now and hit next season running?

Some may not sign. We've only had 2 not sign in the last 3 summers, which is why I said that I hope they're on reduced backup rates, so we actually have funds to get some decent players in for the future.

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12 minutes ago, Tewksbury said:

By underwhelming, I mean exactly that.

I still think we'll be solidly midtable, pushing top half, bit I also think that you could let most of them go and still be in the same position, but not needing to make the same decision next year. Keeping them all on is very much kicking the can down the road, we'll just be in the same situation next season. Why not take the hit now and hit next season running?

Some may not sign. We've only had 2 not sign in the last 3 summers, which is why I said that I hope they're on reduced backup rates, so we actually have funds to get some decent players in for the future.

Why not... ?  For me, simply because we're not established at this level yet.  We're still in it because we had a great  3 -game run right at the end and a solid last six overall.  Other than that we were in a relegation berth all season.  Well as we played in splurges last season, we still had a month or more, (Jan?), when we got absolutely spanked at times by teams much higher up. 

Do we really want to make it potentially harder at the start by bringing in another flood of players, like last season, albeit with a superior manager & coaching staff?  Subject to budget, I think / hope we'll have enough new faces coming in this pre-season.  By now we should seem a decent option to sign for, especially the manager, unlike in January when to a casual observer we were just down there with Rotherham.  

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13 minutes ago, Owling_Wolf said:

Why not... ?  For me, simply because we're not established at this level yet.  We're still in it because we had a great  3 -game run right at the end and a solid last six overall.  Other than that we were in a relegation berth all season.  Well as we played in splurges last season, we still had a month or more, (Jan?), when we got absolutely spanked at times by teams much higher up. 

Do we really want to make it potentially harder at the start by bringing in another flood of players, like last season, albeit with a superior manager & coaching staff?  Subject to budget, I think / hope we'll have enough new faces coming in this pre-season.  By now we should seem a decent option to sign for, especially the manager, unlike in January when to a casual observer we were just down there with Rotherham.  

So why keep almost all the players who were bottom 3 all season?

These are the same nesh players who gained the same amount if points after going behind as Rotherham did.

The bright sparks who improved as the season went on were almost exclusively loans and the younger new signings.

As you said, we aren't favourites for relegation anymore scraping the barrell at the end of the window. There's no reason we can't find younger players with, if not better, at least equivalent talent for a comparable cost. We have 3 work permit waivers, which could easily be 3 first team players on reasonable wages from europe.

We pay players well past when we should be rid. Everyone* whines about it, but when it comes ro actually releasing them everyone* wants to keep them.

*Reesh, by everyone, I mean a reasonable number of vocal fans in real life and on social media.

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43 minutes ago, Tewksbury said:

So why keep almost all the players who were bottom 3 all season?

These are the same nesh players who gained the same amount if points after going behind as Rotherham did.

The bright sparks who improved as the season went on were almost exclusively loans and the younger new signings.

As you said, we aren't favourites for relegation anymore scraping the barrell at the end of the window. There's no reason we can't find younger players with, if not better, at least equivalent talent for a comparable cost. We have 3 work permit waivers, which could easily be 3 first team players on reasonable wages from europe.

We pay players well past when we should be rid. Everyone* whines about it, but when it comes ro actually releasing them everyone* wants to keep them.

*Reesh, by everyone, I mean a reasonable number of vocal fans in real life and on social media.

Oh fuck right off.

 

You're an embittered fool. Fuck off back to Stalk you fit in better there.

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Posted (edited)

A couple of players offered contracts suprised me a bit but not overly so - Dawson, Paterson. I'd  have been gobsmacked if the likes of Palmer, Bannan, Windass hadn't  been offered new terms. A mass clearout of the proven, trusted players would have been folly; and Röhl is no fool. Keeping a nucleus of the solid performers of last season and adding 8 or 9 quality players makes absolute sense. Main thing is that we've  been able to ditch the dross.

 

 

 

Edited by Teddy Nickelarse
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1 hour ago, Tewksbury said:

So why keep almost all the players who were bottom 3 all season?

These are the same nesh players who gained the same amount if points after going behind as Rotherham did.

The bright sparks who improved as the season went on were almost exclusively loans and the younger new signings.

As you said, we aren't favourites for relegation anymore scraping the barrell at the end of the window. There's no reason we can't find younger players with, if not better, at least equivalent talent for a comparable cost. We have 3 work permit waivers, which could easily be 3 first team players on reasonable wages from europe.

We pay players well past when we should be rid. Everyone* whines about it, but when it comes ro actually releasing them everyone* wants to keep them.

*Reesh, by everyone, I mean a reasonable number of vocal fans in real life and on social media.

I don't agree with that, Vaulks, Johnson, Palmer, Iorfa, Windass all improved and contributed to our results improving during second half of season. 

Some of the loans like Ugbo and Beadle contributed too whilst some of the loan signings did very little, Hendrick and Fletcher deserve a mention on that score. 

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20 minutes ago, Teddy Nickelarse said:

A couple of players offered contracts suprised me a bit but not overly so - Dawson, Paterson. I'd  have been gobsmacked if the likes of Palmer, Bannan, Windass hadn't  been offered new terms. A mass clearout of the proven, trusted players would have been folly; and Röhl is no fool. Keeping a nucleus of the solid performers of last season and adding 8 or 9 quality players makes absolute sense. Main thing is that we've  been able to ditch the dross.

 

 

 

Paterson wasn't offered terms we took up the extra year on his contract. At worst he's a valuable versatile squad player or he's a saleable asset 

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Joe Wildsmith let go by Derby - played 40 games last season. Dawson contract offer is stronger I guess but can’t seeing it being as good a deal as he’s currently on. 

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29 minutes ago, Teddy Nickelarse said:

A couple of players offered contracts suprised me a bit but not overly so - Dawson, Paterson. I'd  have been gobsmacked if the likes of Palmer, Bannan, Windass hadn't  been offered new terms. A mass clearout of the proven, trusted players would have been folly; and Röhl is no fool. Keeping a nucleus of the solid performers of last season and adding 8 or 9 quality players makes absolute sense. Main thing is that we've  been able to ditch the dross.

 

 

 

I think the club has every one of the decisions on each player absolutely spot on, just hope they all sign up. Dawson was a no brainer for me, as long as he's a number 2 and Paterson was as well, great asset to have when presented with a scenario like we were v Norwich.

I'm so looking forward to how DR conducts the recruitment now, hope we get some stars in (on the cheap obviously).

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18 minutes ago, Reesh said:

Paterson wasn't offered terms we took up the extra year on his contract. At worst he's a valuable versatile squad player or he's a saleable asset 

Yes I know. The only reason I was a wee bit surprised that we exercised the option was that somes online sages claimed he was on high wages. See that was my schoolboy error. 

 

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27 minutes ago, EBRA said:

Joe Wildsmith let go by Derby - played 40 games last season. Dawson contract offer is stronger I guess but can’t seeing it being as good a deal as he’s currently on. 

He's getting shed loads from man city 

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3 hours ago, Tewksbury said:

By underwhelming, I mean exactly that.

I still think we'll be solidly midtable, pushing top half, bit I also think that you could let most of them go and still be in the same position, but not needing to make the same decision next year. Keeping them all on is very much kicking the can down the road, we'll just be in the same situation next season. Why not take the hit now and hit next season running?

Some may not sign. We've only had 2 not sign in the last 3 summers, which is why I said that I hope they're on reduced backup rates, so we actually have funds to get some decent players in for the future.

1867?

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3 hours ago, Tewksbury said:

So why keep almost all the players who were bottom 3 all season?

These are the same nesh players who gained the same amount if points after going behind as Rotherham did.

The bright sparks who improved as the season went on were almost exclusively loans and the younger new signings.

As you said, we aren't favourites for relegation anymore scraping the barrell at the end of the window. There's no reason we can't find younger players with, if not better, at least equivalent talent for a comparable cost. We have 3 work permit waivers, which could easily be 3 first team players on reasonable wages from europe.

We pay players well past when we should be rid. Everyone* whines about it, but when it comes ro actually releasing them everyone* wants to keep them.

*Reesh, by everyone, I mean a reasonable number of vocal fans in real life and on social media.

1867 ‘till you die.

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