HoylandOwl Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 Now Rohl has come in, let's see how you lot think about what we've got coming..... Go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 Disappointed with the spelling of Röhl and it's only ever three periods. Sorry wrong thread 12th. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boracic Lint Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 This side is and has all season been one win away from being fine, it's mentality not ability keeping them down, which to be fair, isn't entirely their fault. They've been suckerpunched a few times when being competitive or getting on top, making their heads drop and letting the game get away. They've been a soft decision away from winning draws or drawing losses a few times, a bit of confidence or getting the soft decision in our favour and we will be on our way. We've got a much easier run now for the next 10-12 games with only one 'bad' team played so far. Plenty of time to get it sorted, as soon as they get a win and get some confidence they'll start getting points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoylandOwl Posted October 15, 2023 Author Share Posted October 15, 2023 I don't mind an alternative view to our on pitch stuff, Boracic. And I think you have gone against the grain a few times on here, I think you've make some salient points, although I don't agree with being one win away from being fine. Xisco's system just wasn't going to work. The zonal marking that we SEEMED to be employing just didn't work, IMO. I do think we CAN get out of the situation we're in, but there was too many round pegs in square holes, and Xisco didn't seem to 'get it' IMO. We're not a side blessed with Championship top quality talent, that's abundantly clear. It's interesting now that we have a manager younger than our number 9, which is amusing, but I think he will get more of a tune out of them than we've seen so far. While we can be a demanding bunch of supporters, Xisco didn't really connect with us, his words had the feeling more of platitudes, but now with our new manager's words I think if there's a sense that the players are giving absolutely everything they're capable of, then their misgivings in say skill, are somewhat forgiven and they'll be backed to the hilt by the fans. You only have to see the start of the Sunderland game on how despite all things being against the running of the club, and despite things also being turned towards the then manager too, the fans looked to raise the volume to try and lift them. Until the 9th minute of course when the second goal went in (I think it was that early wasn't it?).... As you say, there is plenty of time to get it sorted, and right now. Staying in the division has to be the priority, then we'll see what happens next summer. If we do better than that, and even push the top half of the table. Then our new manager will have exceeded my expectations that's for sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrolMong Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 It’s going to hinge on January. Whiist I think a good coach can make us hard to beat, it’s our ability with the ball, our lack of pace, and our lack of a goal threat that will haunt us, and that has to be addressed the minute the window opens. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boracic Lint Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 8 minutes ago, HoylandOwl said: I don't mind an alternative view to our on pitch stuff, Boracic. And I think you have gone against the grain a few times on here, I think you've make some salient points, although I don't agree with being one win away from being fine. Xisco's system just wasn't going to work. The zonal marking that we SEEMED to be employing just didn't work, IMO. I do think we CAN get out of the situation we're in, but there was too many round pegs in square holes, and Xisco didn't seem to 'get it' IMO. We're not a side blessed with Championship top quality talent, that's abundantly clear. It's interesting now that we have a manager younger than our number 9, which is amusing, but I think he will get more of a tune out of them than we've seen so far. While we can be a demanding bunch of supporters, Xisco didn't really connect with us, his words had the feeling more of platitudes, but now with our new manager's words I think if there's a sense that the players are giving absolutely everything they're capable of, then their misgivings in say skill, are somewhat forgiven and they'll be backed to the hilt by the fans. You only have to see the start of the Sunderland game on how despite all things being against the running of the club, and despite things also being turned towards the then manager too, the fans looked to raise the volume to try and lift them. Until the 9th minute of course when the second goal went in (I think it was that early wasn't it?).... As you say, there is plenty of time to get it sorted, and right now. Staying in the division has to be the priority, then we'll see what happens next summer. If we do better than that, and even push the top half of the table. Then our new manager will have exceeded my expectations that's for sure. We had pretty much the hardest start in the league fixture wise, with no bottom third teams in the first 10 games. We had a few games where they were turned on a moment, half time pen at 1 up v Hull, last minute pen v Cardiff, Boro's equaliser should have been a foul, pen that wasn't at half time v Swansea, then them scoring their second after we hit the bar. Any of these games, without that moment could have been wins, give us the ref from the playoff final and they would have been. We don't have the most mentally resilient squad and these were times when we got hit when, on another day, we wouldn't. It just seemed like we couldn't catch a break and every decision and bounce went against us. This isn't about Xisco, or tactics, it's about heads going down when if we had a win, they wouldn't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 Good debate this. I think Boracic has a point that confidence was key, you could see the heads drop like fuck when concede and there was no coming back from it, had we got a win or two it would have only papered over the cracks of Xiscos reign. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boracic Lint Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 Look at this team under pressure over the last 3 years. They're shockingly bad. Last season: Bottled the league. Couldn't buy a win till it didn't matter anymore then won the last 4. Bottled the first leg. Almost Bottled the final. But when the pressure to win is off, you get Newcastle and the second leg. The early goal v Soton put us on the back foot and every time we seem to get back on the front, something happens to put them right back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellsview Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 There’s some real quality in this division and we can’t just ‘magic’ pace and goals into the side, which is what we need. I still think we are a long way off even the top 15 of this division. I expect us to improve but fourth bottom is still the aim for me. Hopefully the January transfer window will allow Röhl to bring some quality into the side, to help further develop and improve the style of play he wants. If we can stay up then I see much bigger and better things for us moving forward. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoylandOwl Posted October 15, 2023 Author Share Posted October 15, 2023 2 hours ago, Boracic Lint said: We had pretty much the hardest start in the league fixture wise, with no bottom third teams in the first 10 games. We had a few games where they were turned on a moment, half time pen at 1 up v Hull, last minute pen v Cardiff, Boro's equaliser should have been a foul, pen that wasn't at half time v Swansea, then them scoring their second after we hit the bar. Any of these games, without that moment could have been wins, give us the ref from the playoff final and they would have been. We don't have the most mentally resilient squad and these were times when we got hit when, on another day, we wouldn't. It just seemed like we couldn't catch a break and every decision and bounce went against us. This isn't about Xisco, or tactics, it's about heads going down when if we had a win, they wouldn't. There's no doubt at all, that confidence can help a team. We did get kicked in that respect a few times that is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owling_Wolf Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Bellsview said: There’s some real quality in this division and we can’t just ‘magic’ pace and goals into the side, which is what we need. I still think we are a long way off even the top 15 of this division. I expect us to improve but fourth bottom is still the aim for me. Hopefully the January transfer window will allow Röhl to bring some quality into the side, to help further develop and improve the style of play he wants. If we can stay up then I see much bigger and better things for us moving forward. If our cocky mouthpiece fuckwits don't drive the owner to literally refuse any 'extra' funds, including signings, by then. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank_Owl2,0 Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 (edited) Some interesting and good points being made on this thread. Id take just staying up now, with the opportunity to build and improve in a more considered way during the summer, with the chance of brining through some U21s. I agree we were close to having a few more points but we are also setting ourselves up to fail by the way the team selection and chopping and changing has worked. Look how more solid we were when NT went back to basics. Yes it wasn’t a great watch but the guy only had 2 days to work with them. I also think there was an element of XMs approach to fitness and the amount of training was wearing down some of the squad such that they were simply not at it on the match days which also contributed to the heads dropping quickly once they felt the game was not going to go well. DR has to build on what DM did that worked and do a bit of drawing a line under what XM did and moving on. Now I’m not saying keep the DM style of play but I am saying build on it, ie as others have said adapt and evolve not simply throw the baby out because there are too many in the squad that were here last season and were recruited to suit the DM plan. And so far the new recruits with a few exceptions having not shown they can cut it. Anyway I’ll happily take fourth bottom but I’m hoping for mid table. Edited October 15, 2023 by Tank_Owl2,0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boracic Lint Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 8 hours ago, Tank_Owl2,0 said: Some interesting and good points being made on this thread. Id take just staying up now, with the opportunity to build and improve in a more considered way during the summer, with the chance of brining through some U21s. I agree we were close to having a few more points but we are also setting ourselves up to fail by the way the team selection and chopping and changing has worked. Look how more solid we were when NT went back to basics. Yes it wasn’t a great watch but the guy only had 2 days to work with them. I also think there was an element of XMs approach to fitness and the amount of training was wearing down some of the squad such that they were simply not at it on the match days which also contributed to the heads dropping quickly once they felt the game was not going to go well. DR has to build on what DM did that worked and do a bit of drawing a line under what XM did and moving on. Now I’m not saying keep the DM style of play but I am saying build on it, ie as others have said adapt and evolve not simply throw the baby out because there are too many in the squad that were here last season and were recruited to suit the DM plan. And so far the new recruits with a few exceptions having not shown they can cut it. Anyway I’ll happily take fourth bottom but I’m hoping for mid table. The thing is, none of the team were recruited to suit DMs plan. We've recruited wingers and wide forwards for the entirety of his reign. We've recruited in the same way as we did under Xisco, DM just couldn't get it to work. He recruited for and tried the 433/4222/4231 both seasons. People talk about playing players in their natural positions, this is something DM was getting right up to the end. There's only really LWB, which shouldn't have existed if XM hadn't bottled it and kept to 4 at the back. Almost every player under DM struggled at first, as his way of playing was more alien than Xiscos is to the current lot. We had a slow start to both seasons in League One, they've only had a few games this season, give them time. Most of our defensive issues have been set pieces anyway, which has nothing to do with tactics and more with familiarity. Again something DM struggled with early on. Due to fitness, late recruitment and injury we haven't been able to put out a settled side yet, many making their full debuts in the last couple of games. How the fuck are you supposed to put a settled side out in those conditions? As we did the last 2 seasons, we're writing players off already, coming into a new team, in flux, new country, new style, no preseason. If they're doing badly, what's the excuse of the ones who have been here 2 years? They must be proper shite then as the old lot aren't doing any better than the new boys. Faster we get rid the better in that case. As for back to basics being better, it was one of the worst sides put out all season, play that against a non DM side and it's getting mullered, they were by far the worst team we'veplayed so far and were just as slow and ponderous as we were. As it was, we were lucky to get a draw. Rohl had already spoke of his philosophy, of intensity and pressing. Let's see how the 'evolution' goes when half of last season's side can only play high intensity for 20 minutes a game. We could do that in L1, score early then sit back, then another couple of bursts throughout the game with fast 10 minutes at the end. We do that here, we're dead. Just wait till we're playing twice a week with an average squad age of 30, with players who can't or won't keep to the required levels of fitness. The revolution has to come. The sooner the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tylluan Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 We have pace in Musaba and Gassama but do they have the quality or do we just let them loose to run around and cause defences to think a bit more? We also have pace in Phuthi and he is buzzing at the moment, confidence wise. Do we repay the faith in him staying, and not going to Brentford B, and give him a shot? Thompson proved we can be more structured in one game but we need the bite so Rohl has to consider whether he sacrifices that structure and goes for more up top or grinds a couple more results out while working on the team over a longer period and we see his own imprint after the November international break. I'm still aiming for 4th from bottom and anything else is a bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, Neville Facking Bartos said: Don't do expectations, the hope is we stay up Bet you're lass is delighted.....can't accuse you of constantly letting her down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 ...Nev not collected her from her paper round again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 So a 5 league games break coming up to interrupt the all important international fixtures Watford A Plymouth A Toytown H Bristol City A Milllllllllwalĺllllllll H Be intriguing to see how we go. My baseline position for us was say 18th at the start of the season. After seeing the slightly enhanced quality in the Championship that is probably revised to 20th We have been performing at Baseline very negative under Xisco. No one has really argued we are currently in a false position in the table. Will Rohl at least get them organised and playing a system that works. Are our players better suited to the Championship than the evidence has suggested so far. The issue is that we need to play at baseline ++ for a sustained period to get back in the pack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoylandOwl Posted October 18, 2023 Author Share Posted October 18, 2023 Seems that a current EFL boss thinks Röhl’s appointment is ‘exciting’ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto_Man Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 My only expectation is for the football to not be as shit as it was under thong song 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAL Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 All i expect and require from the rest of the season, is to see that they are trying to go forward with the ball. I don't want the players with the most possession, being our defenders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OptimisticOwl Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 I'll settle for play-offs now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoylandOwl Posted October 18, 2023 Author Share Posted October 18, 2023 Optimistic by name…. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OptimisticOwl Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 4 hours ago, holmesfield_owl said: It's 250/1 if you believe, if you really believe 😍 Where can you get those odds? I only have a Paddypower account and they're offering 200/1. At 250/1 I could be tempted to throw a fiver at it/away. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 Whereas at 200s you couldn't 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoylandOwl Posted October 20, 2023 Author Share Posted October 20, 2023 With these new additions to the coaching staff, after Danny, I'm getting a little excited! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Petrie Posted October 20, 2023 Share Posted October 20, 2023 Unbelievable how quickly we seem to have gone from a national laughing stock to feeling like a forward thinking professional outfit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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