Jump to content

Politics shit innit


Recommended Posts

53 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Now we've gone for 7th to 4th in the world's biggest exporters since brexit so I'm not having that.

The rest yes. It was fucked up monumentally which is why I cancelled my membership 

I see so many conflicting stats on the export side, all seeking to support their view. So the unbiased truth would be interesting on that score. Still think aspects of thar could be improved.

Anyway, the Tories need a spell on the bench just to get to their senses. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Andyben said:

Now we've gone for 7th to 4th in the world's biggest exporters since brexit so I'm not having that.

The rest yes. It was fucked up monumentally which is why I cancelled my membership 

We went from 4th to 4th, depends what period you measure.

Take Gold and serviced out and what does it look like then? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think last time out you were choosing between 2 different visions for the country, this time it's felt more like deciding whether or not you put your phone in your left pocket or your right one.

Ironic that when the Tories introduced the voter ID thing they were accused of only doing it for themselves and the first general election we have it they suffer their worst defeat in years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can see why Labour as well as the Tories want to keep first past the post. They both benefit significantly from it.

The nuance of the results fascinates me. Various boundary changes meant the map would change a bit. But our constituency has gone Labour, albeit the Tories not far behind. Harpenden which is a wealthy commuter town to the Lib Dems, The Reform vote and 4 seats, similar with the Greens, Labour losing to Corbyn and independents where there was high Muslim votes, the south / southwest outside the large conurbation areas no Labour seats, Tories imploding in the outer M25, the Midlands seeing the Tories ousted. Could go on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Tories licking their wounds and rightly so. Curtice the polling chap who was pretty spot on with the Exit poll calling they had lost it, Labour just let them implode without doing anything dramatic policy wise to win it. 

The direction the Tories go will be interesting. They have been chipped away by Reform, the Lib Dems and Labour in different areas of the country. Chase Reform and they won't regain the affluent areas.

The one aspect is that UK politics is not currently a 2 party fight, albeit the system favours them, but a 3 opponent fight across the country, just not the same opponent everywhere

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Wollongong Owl said:

He was supposed to stop the boats not the votes 

I mean an emotive subject but the 35k who arrive on the boats is nothing compared to the net 650k that came on a Visa. 

That policy may have appealed in certain areas of the country but in Surrey, Hertfordshire, Somerset there was another dynamic at play.

The most salient comment of the night was probably Jeremy Hunt, you aren't going to vote for a divided party, more focused on the internal squabbling, he actually wished Labour well in now trying to fix the NHS clearly a battle he had lost in Cabinet. 

Many factors why the Tories lost but the mood was predominantly that they lost the publics trust. Starmer gained it without it being resounding in terms of votes.

More pertinent is why turnout was around 60% I think, 40% of the electorate just not engaged in the process 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Crazy that Reform got 500k more votes than the LibDems, but 67 fewer seats

Like I say whilst the 2 main parties ultimately are the main beneficiaries of First Past the Post it ain't changing 

There should be a form of PR but you look elsewhere around the world and question that wisdom 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good to see the SNP take a skelping up here. However, I do find their narrative that "it's not a reflection on Independence" a tad strange. Yes, people in England may well have voted Labour to 'get rid of the Tories' but, up here? There were barely any to start with. Delighted that Douglas Ross got his comeuppance though!

I wonder if Terrestrial TV Rishi will obtain a Green Card before he fucks off to the US this time.

Oh, and, I predict Nigel Farage will resign within a month. He may even join Rishi across the pond...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Andyben said:

That Starmer would be PM and the Tories would deservedly lose.

Crazy that Labour under Starmer got fewer total votes than Corbyn in 2019, don't you think?

Not that one...the other one.

Something about No Absolute Majority?

Does that ring any bells? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"At Leeds, Starmer was influenced by the indie music of the 1980s, from The Smiths and The Wedding Present to Orange Juice and Aztec Camera"

 Definitely deserves to be PM just for that 

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, as expected ,Labour win by an absolute landslide and will now govern for the foreseeable future.

Congratulations, and I mean that sincerely.  Starmer has turned a disaster for Labour into a disaster for the Tories in 5 years. Or has he? Was it the Tories that turned a triumph for them that made it a triumph for Labour?

I suppose we could debate this for the next 5 years but it is what it is.  The Torries will need to have their inquiry and try and find a new leader from the few that's left and Starmer will set about leading us into ...

 

Well, let's revisit where he leads us another day.

 

Drink your Champagne and enjoy the moment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

52 minutes ago, Skamp said:

Well, as expected ,Labour win by an absolute landslide and will now govern for the foreseeable future.

Congratulations, and I mean that sincerely.  Starmer has turned a disaster for Labour into a disaster for the Tories in 5 years. Or has he? Was it the Tories that turned a triumph for them that made it a triumph for Labour?

I suppose we could debate this for the next 5 years but it is what it is.  The Torries will need to have their inquiry and try and find a new leader from the few that's left and Starmer will set about leading us into ...

 

Well, let's revisit where he leads us another day.

 

Drink your Champagne and enjoy the moment.

I'm  like many people Skamp,  Starmer doesn't thrill me and his austerity light offering, just following the Tories fiscal plans aren't going to make much of a difference.  My hope, and I think I'm going to have to wait for it, is that Labour are more bold in Govt than they have been in opposition, otherwise you will have nothing to complain about because effectively you'll be living under a centrist Conservative Govt in all but name.  You'd be much happier about it than I will!

As for the election, the Tories tore themselves apart and gifted it to Labour, who just had to be careful not to say too much or mess it up. Even I would have liked to have seen Labour have to work harder for it.  That said, I am enjoying the destruction of the Tory party that started with the ERG and has led to today.  It feels good to see some of the vilest characters, like my former MP Philip Davies get the kicking they deserve.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Andyben said:

Here's your new Attorney General...

https://www.matrixlaw.co.uk/member/richard-hermer/

and Equalities Minister 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/harriet-harman-expresses-regret-over-links-to-paedophile-campaign-group-9151512.html

Good news for Asylum Speakers and Nonces in the first 24hrs of the new government 

So the new AG is a supporter of BDS and other anti-Israeli programs and represented Gerry Adams.

Wonderful 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, BraddersTim said:

I'm  like many people Skamp,  Starmer doesn't thrill me and his austerity light offering, just following the Tories fiscal plans aren't going to make much of a difference.  My hope, and I think I'm going to have to wait for it, is that Labour are more bold in Govt than they have been in opposition, otherwise you will have nothing to complain about because effectively you'll be living under a centrist Conservative Govt in all but name.  You'd be much happier about it than I will!

As for the election, the Tories tore themselves apart and gifted it to Labour, who just had to be careful not to say too much or mess it up. Even I would have liked to have seen Labour have to work harder for it.  That said, I am enjoying the destruction of the Tory party that started with the ERG and has led to today.  It feels good to see some of the vilest characters, like my former MP Philip Davies get the kicking they deserve.

 

 

There is an irony in that I feel comfortable with Starmer and his team running the country. The voices you don't hear generally are the big lump of the centre ground. It is perhaps getting chipped away as social media enables populist views, whether that be Reform or the Greens, the Muslim vote in certain areas (getting less air time but just as significant). 

The vast majority still just want things to work, give zero fucks about political ideology. The reality is that in non urban areas from central England to the south West the opposition is the Lib Dems, the archetypal centre ground party

We have in theory a centre nudge left Govt but there is bleating from the loony left, who have never come up with a tangible, workable plan for one of the largest global economies.

The make up of the Cabinet is now as much council estate than Eton, which is a start at least.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Skamp said:

Well, as expected ,Labour win by an absolute landslide and will now govern for the foreseeable future.

Congratulations, and I mean that sincerely.  Starmer has turned a disaster for Labour into a disaster for the Tories in 5 years. Or has he? Was it the Tories that turned a triumph for them that made it a triumph for Labour?

I suppose we could debate this for the next 5 years but it is what it is.  The Torries will need to have their inquiry and try and find a new leader from the few that's left and Starmer will set about leading us into ...

 

Well, let's revisit where he leads us another day.

 

Drink your Champagne and enjoy the moment.

I generally fall into the oxymoron category of being a social conservative. A voter that flips between the parties that accord with the generality of my views. One that could not vote for the nutjobs of the right, in the same way I would reject the vision of Corbyn on the left.

Like a new Wednesday manager I will give Starmer a chance. He is dull and focuses on the substance not style, which frankly to try and fix the structural issues of the UK is what is needed. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Andyben said:

So the new AG is a supporter of BDS and other anti-Israeli programs and represented Gerry Adams.

Wonderful 

I'm not even going to click the link.

We've literally had 14 years of nutjobs with dodgy links & incompetents in senior positions governing our lives, so it seems a bit rich for you to suddenly start digging dirt on the new encumbants.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

He's the head of matrix chambers, you remember them, Cherie's firm that profited immensely from her husbands  decision to sign up to ECHR etc and fought to keep terrorists and criminals in the UK that's the core reason for the problems with immigration today.

Britain is properly fucked now.

 

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, Azuliblancos said:

Morning. How’s everyone doing? 
🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹

Cry more, Andyben 😂😂😂😂

More funny is how many very left leaning folk are utterly gutted Starmer has got in. Cry wanking over their pics of Corbyn 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I sincerely hope Labour do everything they said they were going to, plus all the other stuff we know they'll do but darent put in their manifesto (nationalise rail, rejoin EU etc).

It will be awesome.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

We’ll never, ever get the deal we previously had with the EU.

No rebate and a single currency will be red lines in Brussels. 
 

if we go for some EU lite just to gain access to the single market, we’ll be back to square one in terms of global trade deals and the ECHR

I get why some folk are miffed we’re out of the EU, but it will be far more costly, and potentially damagIng, trying to reverse it now. 

Edited by Skamp
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Skamp said:

We’ll never, ever get the deal we previously had with the EU.

No rebate and a single currency will be red lines in Brussels. 
 

if we go for some EU lite just to gain access to the single market, we’ll be back to square one in terms of global trade deals and the ECHR

I get why some folk are miffed we’re out of the EU, but it will be far more costly, and potentially damagIng, trying to reverse it now. 

Exactly...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Andyben said:

I sincerely hope Labour do everything they said they were going to, plus all the other stuff we know they'll do but darent put in their manifesto (nationalise rail, rejoin EU etc).

It will be awesome.

After traveling on trains in England last month, I honestly don't think there's anything they could do to make it worse than it is right now. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Andyben said:

He's the head of matrix chambers, you remember them, Cherie's firm that profited immensely from her husbands  decision to sign up to ECHR etc and fought to keep terrorists and criminals in the UK that's the core reason for the problems with immigration today.

Britain is properly fucked now.

 

Yeah it's all down to Cherie Blair 😂

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Andyben said:

I sincerely hope Labour do everything they said they were going to, plus all the other stuff we know they'll do but darent put in their manifesto (nationalise rail, rejoin EU etc).

It will be awesome.

Funny thing is, I hope they do that too.

Spoiler...they won't.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, BraddersTim said:

Funny thing is, I hope they do that too.

Spoiler...they won't.

I genuinely ask the remainer type, do you actually want to re-join the political union of the EU ?

I throw in the caveat that if it is possible to get a free(ish) trade deal and freedom of movement, ok that will be in exchange for following certain EU rules but primarily at the business level, would you want to re-join the political union ?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, mkowl said:

I genuinely ask the remainer type, do you actually want to re-join the political union of the EU ?

I throw in the caveat that if it is possible to get a free(ish) trade deal and freedom of movement, ok that will be in exchange for following certain EU rules but primarily at the business level, would you want to re-join the political union ?

 

Am I the "remainder type"😂

For now, I'd settle for a free (er) trade deal, FOM and a grown up relationship with the EU. 

I don't think we"ll rejoin in my lifetime. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, BraddersTim said:

Am I the "remainder type"😂

For now, I'd settle for a free (er) trade deal, FOM and a grown up relationship with the EU. 

I don't think we"ll rejoin in my lifetime. 

As a leaver type I actually concur 

My point is if that can be achieved why would you want the political union ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

48 minutes ago, BraddersTim said:

Am I the "remainder type"😂

For now, I'd settle for a free (er) trade deal, FOM and a grown up relationship with the EU. 

I don't think we"ll rejoin in my lifetime. 

I can't see FoM being in the table as its utterly incompatible with what all have said about controlling migration.

Unless of course, by  control he meant a return to the complete unfettered influx we had before.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Andyben said:

I can't see FoM being in the table as its utterly incompatible with what all have said about controlling migration.

Unless of course, by  control he meant a return to the complete unfettered influx we had before.

But that's the thing. Immigration is far higher now than it was under FOM. So "completely unfettered" is more applicable now than it was then.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, mkowl said:

As a leaver type I actually concur 

My point is if that can be achieved why would you want the political union ?

It's a good point and tbf during the referendum I was hoping to hear convincing arguments about how the relationship with the EU would look & under a sensible government we could have negotiated better trade agreements etc. Then, Brexit might have worked.

But they didn't and it hasn't. 

Now it's up to Labour to do something more progressive.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...