Owling_Wolf Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Having noticed a particular team were in the National League, it occurred to me to wonder how it was decided whether they should be in the North or South section. One or two of them sounded strangely listed for where they are geographically. Then I spotted a really challenging case: two near neighbours, Bishops Stortford of the N. L. North and Braintree of the N. L. South. How does that work? Checking Google Maps showed them to be 20 miles apart but not north to south, east to west! There's going to be very little lattitude between them, even allowing that U.K. maps are often 'straightened up': twisted to fit more easily into a rectangular page. Does anyone reading actually know how is it decided which of the two leagues a promoted or relegated club goes into? Is it always the same for them once they're in it; is it potentially different every season depending upon which the other clubs are that season; if the club goes up or down and then returns to that level again, do they go back into the one they were in before or can it be either, depending on the other clubs that are in them that season? Why is it important? Well think about it. Those two East Anglian clubs are close neighbours, 20 miles away. Instead of enjoying a healthy, profitable rivalry, one of them gets to play Spennymoor in County Durham whilst the other gets to play a club in Cornwall. And, you guessed it, it's Braintree, the further east of the two, that plays Truro! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 It all depends on who comes down from the league above I believe Fred, Brackley tend to flit between the NLN/NLS depending on who goes up/comes down. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owling_Wolf Posted February 27 Author Share Posted February 27 I've certainly seen some bonkers ones in the past, Reesh. Teams well out of their natural area. That must have a serious affect financially sometimes. Other fans not visiting, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tylluan Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 It goes back to 1992 and the creation of the Premier League. All Football League first division clubs resigned in order to form the Premiership and this caused a restructure of the divisions below. This had a knock on effect into the Conference and below. The Isthmian league was the biggest reshuffle, combining divisions to create a more centralised North and South system. This completely screwed some teams up, Bishop's Stortford being one of them. Where you sit in the Pyramid system is also dependent on your closest affiliated FA. Wednesday come under Sheffield and Hallamshire and technically we'd sit under NE Counties in the system. Where that feeds up determines your promotion route through the pyramid but there's no straight line separating North and South. There's a border zone where you could get put in either depending on other relegation/promotion criteria. Hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Owling_Wolf said: Having noticed a particular team were in the National League, it occurred to me to wonder how it was decided whether they should be in the North or South section. One or two of them sounded strangely listed for where they are geographically. Then I spotted a really challenging case: two near neighbours, Bishops Stortford of the N. L. North and Braintree of the N. L. South. How does that work? Checking Google Maps showed them to be 20 miles apart but not north to south, east to west! There's going to be very little lattitude between them, even allowing that U.K. maps are often 'straightened up': twisted to fit more easily into a rectangular page. Does anyone reading actually know how is it decided which of the two leagues a promoted or relegated club goes into? Is it always the same for them once they're in it; is it potentially different every season depending upon which the other clubs are that season; if the club goes up or down and then returns to that level again, do they go back into the one they were in before or can it be either, depending on the other clubs that are in them that season? Why is it important? Well think about it. Those two East Anglian clubs are close neighbours, 20 miles away. Instead of enjoying a healthy, profitable rivalry, one of them gets to play Spennymoor in County Durham whilst the other gets to play a club in Cornwall. And, you guessed it, it's Braintree, the further east of the two, that plays Truro! 1 hour ago, Reesh said: It all depends on who comes down from the league above I believe Fred, Brackley tend to flit between the NLN/NLS depending on who goes up/comes down. Same used to happen in the old Div 3 S/N didn't it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 26 minutes ago, Tylluan said: It goes back to 1992 and the creation of the Premier League. All Football League first division clubs resigned in order to form the Premiership Grear quiz question right there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skamp Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 2 hours ago, Tylluan said: It goes back to 1992 and the creation of the Premier League. All Football League first division clubs resigned in order to form the Premiership us included Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBO Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Hence Spurs becoming the first non football league team to play in the league cup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelters Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Once you’ve got that figured out, get your head round teams from the Natuonal League North being relegated to the Southern League (which one of my local teams Gloucester City is heading for) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tylluan Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 @Chelters don't they play in the Roy of the Rovers kit? Seem to remember Gloucester got put in the North because Worcester refused to be moved out of the South. There was a massive controversy about it with the FA being threatened with legal action and all sorts. Then didn't they get moved into National South because they had to ground share with a Southern League team because the FA changed the ground rules? Then put back in North when the new ground was ready. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 7 hours ago, Reesh said: It all depends on who comes down from the league above I believe Fred, Brackley tend to flit between the NLN/NLS depending on who goes up/comes down. Brackley not that far away from here - but I think the distribution of teams is impacted somewhat by finance. Lot more south east clubs with the proximity to London have gotten the funding to progress. Eg the chap from Dorking who is a bit higher profile on social media. Bang in the middle of the Surrey commuter belt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelters Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, Tylluan said: @Chelters don't they play in the Roy of the Rovers kit? Seem to remember Gloucester got put in the North because Worcester refused to be moved out of the South. There was a massive controversy about it with the FA being threatened with legal action and all sorts. Then didn't they get moved into National South because they had to ground share with a Southern League team because the FA changed the ground rules? Then put back in North when the new ground was ready. Yeah something like that, they were at Evesham for a while. Always used to play in gold and black but they are indeed Melchester red and yellow now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 (edited) Been thinking of sacking the whole A1/M1/M18 stadium off and relocating The Wednesday to a more amenable area closer to London. Let thatot have Sheffield no loss really is it. Edited February 27 by Andyben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 14 minutes ago, Andyben said: Been thinking of sacking the whole A1/M1/M18 stadium off and relocating The Wednesday to a more amenable area closer to London. Let thatot have Sheffield no loss really is it. Sure a joint bid with Red Bull and utilising a stadium that is fit for modern purpose - 45 miles to London, many direct trains per hour, just off Jn 14 of the M1 would be ideal 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 And not forgetting its only 15 minutes drive from where I live and the Mrs can drop me off and go off shopping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBO Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Yeah that's what she'd tell you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 9 hours ago, JBO said: Yeah that's what she'd tell you If he picks up the shopping bill it's a deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 9 hours ago, mkowl said: Sure a joint bid with Red Bull and utilising a stadium that is fit for modern purpose - 45 miles to London, many direct trains per hour, just off Jn 14 of the M1 would be ideal I know the city of Milton Keynes has no soul, you don't have to copy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 MK no soul or Reesh R Sole? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 22 minutes ago, Andyben said: MK no soul or Reesh R Sole? Pipe down Norman Stanley Fletcher. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hirstys 12th Pint Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 (edited) On about locations of teams within Divisions the Northern League last season was particularly Sothern bias. I work with a Notts County fan and we were talking about Gateshead. Last season they had to travel 11,184 miles for their games. They had 14 games with in excess of a 500 miles round trip Appreciate it will always be an issue for teams in the North East but even more so last season and their costs must have been astronomical. Edited February 28 by Hirstys 12th Pint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyben Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 25 minutes ago, Reesh said: Pipe down Norman Stanley Fletcher. Godber 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owling_Wolf Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 15 hours ago, Chelters said: Once you’ve got that figured out, get your head round teams from the Natuonal League North being relegated to the Southern League (which one of my local teams Gloucester City is heading for) 🤯 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkowl Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 3 hours ago, Reesh said: I know the city of Milton Keynes has no soul, you don't have to copy it. Full of ex londoners really so absolutely plenty of r souls Why i live in a village just get the inbred families to worry about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owling_Wolf Posted March 1 Author Share Posted March 1 On 28/02/2024 at 08:27, Hirstys 12th Pint said: On about locations of teams within Divisions the Northern League last season was particularly Sothern bias. I work with a Notts County fan and we were talking about Gateshead. Last season they had to travel 11,184 miles for their games. They had 14 games with in excess of a 500 miles round trip Appreciate it will always be an issue for teams in the North East but even more so last season and their costs must have been astronomical. Truro must knock some mileage up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reesh Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 7 hours ago, Owling_Wolf said: Truro must knock some mileage up. Even more so when they are playing home games at Gloucester due to pitch issues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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