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1 hour ago, Hirstys 12th Pint said:

Did not even bother with the highlights.

Having watched the game, I’m not sure there were any. 
 

We have Foden, Bellingham, Saka and Kane. Those four start for pretty much every club out there and need to start every game for England, with the first two being as central as possible. They also all (now) play for clubs who play against all out defence regularly, which England did yesterday. Bellingham being pushed out to the wing to accommodate Henderson is unbelievable, as was bringing Bellingham off. He’s been Real’s best player this season and deserves better. 

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3 hours ago, Otto_Man said:

Herman Maguire getting some hammer for apparently marking one of his team mates when Ukraine scored. Not seen it mind 

Tbh,

Rice was culpable for blame, he let Zinchenko go behind him. But no, those more focussed on blaming Maguire for everything decided that it was his fault. 

Maguire wasn’t bad yesterday. He was better than Guehi. 

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Maguire got really exposed at man u. Too much space in frint of him when defending, push up and exposed for pace,sit back and get slagged.

If Ten Bob is playing Amrabat and Casemiro in front of him it should help, as may Onana playing 20yds higher than De Gea

His strength is 18yd line defending and bringing ball out to play forward, not across the back.

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Maguire has never let England down, and I think he’s an international defender, but he’s not going to be a regular in any top 6 side. Any team that press high, and leave people one on one, he gets destroyed. And any team that keeps possession, it means he’s got to play on the halfway line, and he struggles.

@Andyben is right, he’s very very good at defending the 18 yard line. But the issue that England have is that he won’t come out, which brings his midfield players back in. Stones is FAR more adept at that type of play, and Lewis Dunk does it at Brighton.

Maguire needs to leave, a lot of the players don’t trust him with the ball and he’s behind 3 others, in what is a pretty poor Man Utd side.

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For the second part, @KrolMong, that's lies at Southgate feet.

With Rice in his role he can drop to cover HM if he goes forward and quite easily rotate with Stones fr longer periods (HM doesn't have enough to move up to a 6).

England have a forward 5 that can shift positions laterally and at times rotate vertically and really break up oppponests lines and defensive structures...IF Kane is replaced by Maddison, Grealish in a false 9, and Foden and Bellingham play as 10s (either of whom can fill the false 9 or play a very advanced central 10) with Rashford and Sakha as the wide strikers.

Its crazy the options to change and mix it up during matches with those five up front

But would you drop Kane? 

Edited by Andyben
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On 10/09/2023 at 15:43, HoylandOwl said:

Tbh,

Rice was culpable for blame, he let Zinchenko go behind him. But no, those more focussed on blaming Maguire for everything decided that it was his fault. 

Maguire wasn’t bad yesterday. He was better than Guehi. 

I think Rice is massively overrated.  West Ham are doing better since he left.

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  • 3 weeks later...
31 minutes ago, KrolMong said:

Ward Prowse has not got in and he should

Southgate when asked about Ward Prowse acknowledged he was doing well but couldn't find a space for him due to Rice Henderson and Phillips doing so well in the last squad camp. 

Then two minutes later said that he didn't pick players on name, he picked them on form. Phillips must have had a hell of a game in that 20 minute cameo in City's loss to Wolves. 

 

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4 hours ago, M42Owl said:

Put in a dire performance against Italy on Tuesday and we most likely will be level on points with both Ukraine and Italy. 

That’s technically true, but we’d have a game in hand over Ukraine, whose remaining game would be against Italy, whilst we’re playing North Macedonia and Malta. I’m no Southgate fan, but we’ve all but qualified. 

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1 hour ago, Gamblor said:

That’s technically true, but we’d have a game in hand over Ukraine, whose remaining game would be against Italy, whilst we’re playing North Macedonia and Malta. I’m no Southgate fan, but we’ve all but qualified. 

Are you sure we're allowed to be positive?  I've not read the small print.

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2 hours ago, Gamblor said:

That’s technically true, but we’d have a game in hand over Ukraine, whose remaining game would be against Italy, whilst we’re playing North Macedonia and Malta. I’m no Southgate fan, but we’ve all but qualified. 

Yes, I know. 
But a current big lead and “as good as qualified” could be “ahead of third only on GD” in a few days.
 

And yes, we should pick up the necessary points against N Macedonia and/or Malta, but it’s England. They’re almost as good as Wednesday for cocking it up.

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8 minutes ago, M42Owl said:

Yes, I know. 
But a current big lead and “as good as qualified” could be “ahead of third only on GD” in a few days.
 

And yes, we should pick up the necessary points against N Macedonia and/or Malta, but it’s England. They’re almost as good as Wednesday for cocking it up.

Tell me about it. I don't remember the details but didn't we fail to qualify for what's now the Euros whilst World Champions?  (Mind you, I think only eight nations qualified back then.)

 

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27 minutes ago, Owling_Wolf said:

Tell me about it. I don't remember the details but didn't we fail to qualify for what's now the Euros whilst World Champions?  (Mind you, I think only eight nations qualified back then.)

 

Close, we finished 3rd (only 4 teams qualified in those days)

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6 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Against the worst England selection in living memory.

Hope they get beat

I acknowledge that he's giving various candidates a look but the fact they're all chucked in together invalidates it. It needs to be one or perhaps two tyros put in with the established players in order to a) judge them properly and b) give them a chance.

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Still on paper this England team should still easily dispatch this opposition.  It’s a perfect illustration of the old adage that football isn’t played on paper.  You need to function as a unit, however technically and/or athletically inferior the opposition may be man for man.

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We don’t need to be experimenting with players like Jordan Henderson. No issues with Tomori and Dunk getting a go, although both were poor. Colwill was ok but long term he’s a centre half.

I’m not remotely a fan of Conor Gallagher.

If there was a positive it was probably TAA, as anything good came from him. But he’s not playing at club level, neither is Grealish at the minute. Maddison deserves his spot, and did ok.

Was a poor performance and did show the gap between the top boys and the rest.

Walker, Stones, Shaw, Rice, Bellingham, Foden, Saka, Kane - they are a long way clear of the back ups. A 100% fit Grealish, an in form Rashford (he’s a mile off) and a playing Maguire also improve things. Trippier is close too but at right back.

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