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The Posh vs. The Owls Matchday Thread


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The one thing IMHO about referees is that they have no comeuppance (there's a word for you).

They can be as "shit" or "biased" or "bent" as they want and there is no culpability for any of them.

"IF" they are found to have done a misdemeanour, what do they get...

Relegated to the lower leagues, Fuck Right Off...

If they get it wrong in one division, why the hell would they get the same scenario correct in a lower division.

Answer is, "They Won't", so ban the incompetent fookers until they know what they are doing.

That is where my question about scoring them comes in.

 

Rant Over...

 

Until the next one 😄

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1 minute ago, MAL said:

The one thing IMHO about referees is that they have no comeuppance (there's a word for you).

They can be as "shit" or "biased" or "bent" as they want and there is no culpability for any of them.

"IF" they are found to have done a misdemeanour, what do they get...

Relegated to the lower leagues, Fuck Right Off...

If they get it wrong in one division, why the hell would they get the same scenario correct in a lower division.

Answer is, "They Won't", so ban the incompetent fookers until they know what they are doing.

That is where my question about scoring them comes in.

 

Rant Over...

 

Until the next one 😄

It was his first game reffing us tonight, hopefully his last, the incompetent Derbyshire sheep molesting *****

 

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The thing that annoys me most about tonight, (no not the referee) is the Byers substitution.

On Saturday the manager finally decided to bring him on because the midfield was lacking in all sorts of ways and his all round game was needed,

Tonight, when we really wanted and had his all round game, he took him off.

Game over.

DM comes out in the media and has a little go at the fans for booing, wrong way to go about it when even the player (i know a lot do it, but not in this instance) knows it is totally the wrong decision.

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1 hour ago, mkowlthesexynewversion said:

Not checked it but apparently we have had very few shots on target so far this season.

We seemed to have retreated into our shell again in that respect with regard to attacking intent and the football is becoming the pragmatic safety first approach. 

 

We haven't had a proper forward line for more than about ten minutes this season.  Until Smith and Gregory have formed a partnership, that parti cular partnership just isn't valid, IMO. 

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Glad I woke up to read Moore's post match comments to immediately put me in a bad mood for the rest of the day.

Again he made reference to conceding set piece goals last season, inferring that we have success this year as they are from open play. Anyone going to tell him they all count the same. 

I know there are player ratings but on a manager rating last night I am being generous at a 4 / 10

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6 hours ago, Owling_Wolf said:

At 2-0 tonight it seemed the folks around us were baying for Tom, Dick n Harry to be sent on and get stuck right into them, turn it around. Stuff that. Game's gone. Keep our remaining powder dry on the bench. Stuff it right up Bolton on Saturday!  

Actually at 1-0 the lack of action from the sidelines was utterly stark. He was bringing on Adeniran before the first goal, it got shelved. Why ?

Subs could and should have been made after that first goal. Put some energy on there, go 4 4 1 or something, make them think. 

Instead they kept doing the same thing and got the 2nd, could have been worse.

Its alright thinking about Saturday but you could end up with a red card etc, who knows. 

He threw in the towel at 1-0, zero clue on a Plan B once the masterplan of keeping a clean sheet was done.

He continues to come second in the tactical battles against other managers. Are you happy with that, are you convinced when it comes to the crunch he has the skills to get us promoted ?

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Disappointing last night. No getting around it, when we lose Im not happy as Im sure most on here are.

However, after a bit of reflection time I think its fair to say the red card changed the game, no surprise there, but I genuinely think that outcome would have been different for us with 11 on the pitch (again bit of an obvious thing). However, I dont think Pboro would have expose our wing backs in the same way.

Im a bit perplexed by this obsession with conceding from crosses by RS. Its a weakness DM needs to address, but its also part of the negative of playing a 5-3-2 formation where the wing backs are expected to get up the pitch. Combine that with only having 10 men on the pitch and a left wing back that is better at going forward than defending, then yes if I was the oppo coach Id be focussing on that. People chunter about us being negative and worrying about the opposition, then in that case we'd have Palmer playing LWB every game (or James). With 11 men on the pitch Id rather someone that going to provide good crosses and someone that can beat a man aka Johnson. When we went down to 10 DM didnt have much choice in how he could change the backline in my view. As was said elsewhere, maybe Iorfa would be a better RWB, he certainly did a decent job in a similar position when Steve Bruce was in charge, which may mean we can use Palmer at LWB when needed.

Anyway, what Im thinking is, DM cant do right for doing wrong. Set up with a LWB that is going to be a useful outlet for runs and crosses or sit back with a LWB that wont get over the halfway.

As for how we did after we went down to 10, its all about choices and knowing what players fitness is like. I was puzzled at why Adeniran not going on, but maybe DM just decided the game/ result is gone its pointless chasing it and depending on how do on Saturday Id live with that if we turn in a performance against Notlob.

Byers going off, yes he was frustrated. Was it worth Jamie Smith antagonising the situation, no. Just let Byers cool off and then have a word. I think Byers is a great player and hope he get used more often so we can see the kind of performances we saw at the end of last season. Initially I felt the same as some folk on here, why take him off but when I reflect on it I can understand why DM decide on Byers. He wanted to keep some goal threat (so keep LG), he wanted athleticism so Bakinson and I suppose Paterson (he also has the shithousery which was probably going to be needed), Vaulks has been brough into be the anchor man, could Byers do better maybe but Vaulks also has a bit more height. Maybe take another defender off, I cant see how that would work. So yes Byers by deduction was the most likely choice - I think. Do you bring on Iorfa, well that again maybe like all of this is an imperfect decision, ie all about compromises. I think he was thinking lets hold on, so put a defender, whilst having Paterson and Gregory there for potential breakway/ set play goals.

What I guess we missed is having Smith either on the bench or on the pitch that would have been perfect to have as the lone striker in a game with 10 men, but I dont think you can argue with the effort Gregory but in and the way he holds the ball up.

Finally the ref. Ive just come to expect shite refs in this league and Mr Oldham didnt let the side down. As DM said, and after watching back a couple of time, its a red card in todays game. I dont agree with it, when you consider there was no intent, their player made a right meal of it and it wasnt in a position where they were going have a shot on goal. Like Reesh says though, it the fvcking inconsistency that just make my piss boil. I dont think any of the refs weve had this season have been consistent. Was he any worse than the others weve had, no I dont think so.

So, Saturday we need to see a reaction. A draw minimum with a good performance, but a win is what we should be going out to deliver. The weather looks like it will be good for football, so we cant be complaining about its too hot for high tempo etc. We need to go their and get the first punch and make them chase the game. They won last night and are building up a bit of a head of steam after finishing quite strongly last season. Its going to have to be another reshuffle with no James but Id go with this, with a slight question mark over Gregory, after hes done 84mins last night, mainly whether DM will want to start him  

Stockdale

Hunt

Ihiekwe

Heneghan

Palmer

Johnson

Vaulks

Byers

Adeniran

Windass

Gregory

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11 hours ago, Reesh said:

Iorfa has gone, I'd get rid.

I can see why you think that. But I still think he could do a job as a right back,  not wing back,  he hasn't enough quality on ball. But is Moore going 2 play with back 4? He did at Donny but doesn't look like he will now

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Last night was so frustrating for a myriad of reasons. We huffed and puffed before the red card and looked the better side in what was a very open game. The red card, at the time I thought was over the top, yet on second viewing it was the right call. It was James that was over the top. That killed the rest of the first half, then it seemed like at the start of the 2nd we'd got a little composure back and were trying to have a go, of course we then get the standard way to score against us open us up like a can of beans yet again. 

I can't understand how, or why, the management/players no matter who they are, can't deal with a team attacking down the same side, and a regular cross on such a consistent basis. Peterborough weren't that good, they didn't have to be. But that came from having an extra man on the field of course. 

Stockdale had a bit of a wobble of a game,  but then he also made one very good save and showed decent positioning in other situations. However, he's not to blame for defeat.

The midfield didn't get going, again though. Not having the players in there, was the reason for that IMO. The substitution which caused all the bother was baffling, Byers was right to be pissed off, I'd rather a player show passion for wanting to stay on. I think Jamie Smith was in the wrong for losing it after Byers was disgruntled with the decision, he should know why Byers was pissed off. But we bring on a centre back, who didn't effect the game whatsoever, then late on there's a decision to withdraw another centre back.... For a forward. It's baffling. Usually you see a striker sacrificed if a defender is sent off, now, I'm not suggesting that we should 'follow the usual convention' type of thing, but I don't think the management team read the situation. 

It's not all gone to hell in a handcart, we move on to Saturday. Bolton are in decent form. If we get back to winning ways, we're back on 2 points per game average. And that's where we HAVE to be if we harbour any true ambitions of success.

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Just seen DM on Sky Sports News. 

He said on the Byers reaction, he'll take a look back at it. Then assess the situation. 

HIs next line though was very odd. 

"George was probably enjoying himself, was getting on the ball and controlling the game."

WELL IF YOU THOUGHT HE WAS CONTROLLING THE GAME, THEN WHY TAKE HIM OFF???????

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Here's Yorkshire Live's transcription of what DM said post game. 

What did you make of the red card?

It is a red card. I have seen it back.

It was not deliberate. Reece has gone to block it and the lad has beaten him to it. It was a high leg.

As the lad played it past him, his momentum carried him but Reece's leg was still quite high and straight. The lad has run into him. With his leg being high and straight, it gave the referee a decision. The decision went against us and changed the balance of the game.

Is there anything you could have done differently after the red card?

I kept the two up top. We sensed a little bit of nervousness from Peterborough up until that point.

We kept two on the pitch and the midfield slid across and the wing backs worked across the pitch.

The goals came from crosses they put into the box. I will look back at the two goals as you always think with crosses into the box you can defend them. They were two replica goals.

We are disappointed because we came here with a game plan. I thought the way we started we would get the upperhand in the game. I am disappointed with the red card.

Why are the team struggling to defend crosses?

Up until the 10 men, we didn't have that issue. We were in the game before the sending off. It changed the complexion of the game. They had an extra man in the central and wide areas.

When you have a 3 v 2 out wide, it is difficult to deal with because they had an extra man. They got balls into the box and you have got to defend the box.

It only takes one moment and they got on the end of it and went one nil up. You then have to change to try and get back in the game.

When you chase in the game, you are going to leave more pockets and holes and that's where they second goal came from us.

Are you ever going to be able to solve this issues with crosses?

One hundred per cent. Let's not make this into a problem that it is not.

It is a problem but it is our first loss of the season. Let's not throw the toys out.

We lost the game, one hundred per cent, tonight from the sending off. If we had lost with 11 men, I could understand it.

It changed the course of the game. I am very, very honest and I am very factual with my points.

We didn't come here to lie down and you saw 10 players give their all for the club. I thought up until the red card they were nervous and misplaced their passes. I thought we were getting on top.

Greggors and Pato were getting a hold of the ball and getting us up the pitch. Everything was right about it.

But we have conceded two goals from crosses and we will look at it again. The disappointment in me is we lost the game through going down to 10 men.

Why did you make four changes?

Josh Windass is coming back from a year off, having been injured. He has played two full 90 minutes.

The heat on Saturday left the players' energy levels low. Barry Bannan suffered from a bit of heat exhaustion on Saturday. He didn't train yesterday.

Those two had to be taken out. Hopefully both of those players will reap the rewards from tonight and be available from the squad in the week.

What did you make of the clash between George Byers and Jamie Smith in the first half? Have you spoken to them?

I’ll find out now. and when I see you on Friday we’ll have a little chat.

Do you mind a player reacting like that when they come off?

After the sending off I was just thinking in my head about getting in at half time. Firstly you don’t think anything like that is going to happen - but I’ll ask the questions to both men, and see what was said.

I would almost 100% put it down to frustration, heat of the moment and the pulsating atmosphere. If it’s anymore than that I’d be really surprised.

I’m not really alarmed by it or anything, but I will look into it, and when we have the press conference on Friday I’ll happily speak about what went on.

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13 hours ago, Reesh said:

The first 30/35 minutes we were on par if not the better team then a lapse of judgement by James and we were on the back foot.

 

Moore then bottled it by making a very rash substitution,  he could have put Paterson in the back 3 and left Byers on if he had just waited a bit.

 

His naivety and over reliance on certain picks at times is his downfall. 

Totally agree with this.

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10 hours ago, Neville Facking Bartos said:

I know it’s only early but someone please explain what Vaulks offers. Weird neither him or Bakinson got pulled tonight, the midfield had an absolute mare one Byers went off

As for another 2 goals down our left side, I like Johnson but please please please get a proper wingback

Moore defending the goals we’ve conceded so far saying he’ll analyse it. It’s very fucking simple, reduce the number of balls coming in to the box. It’s weird how comfortable we appear in allowing deliveries to go in to the box, shit loads tonight, no wonder we conceded 

Vaulks is a typical DM buy. Great player in a position we don't actually have or utilise him in.

He's a sitter in Midfield but Moore plays him more advanced. 

Same as him buying a raft of central defender, one of whom made last year's team of the season, that play as one of a pair in a back 4. 

James is a Left Back not a Wing Back (which is what we needed). 

Marvin Johnson is a left midfielder which is something we ve not had since the heady CC days with Bannan and Helan.

Windass is an attacking midfielder, #10. He's played less than a handful of games there.

Needs to look at the players and pick a team around them.

Square pegs and square holes. Who'll be our new Dave Jones?

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I would love him to revert to a 4-4-1-1 at Bolton just to see how it works.

                 Stockdale

Hunt Ihekwe Henagan Palmer

Adeniran Byers/Vaulks  FDB Johnson

                  Windass

                  Gregory 

Edited by Laceups
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47 minutes ago, HoylandOwl said:

As for Moore to comment about the conceding from crosses. "lets not make it a problem that it is not"

Well.....

Here's are goals we've conceded this season.... No problem? 

 

 

You could add the goals in the Wigan friendly game as well. They were similar

But, but, but we're not conceding from set pieces, the management say

 

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Just now, Laceups said:

I would love him to revert to a 4-4-1-1 at Bolton just to see how it works.

                 Stockdale

Hunt Ihekwe Henagan Palmer

Adeniran Byres FDB Johnson

                  Windass

                  Gregory 

Jorge Byrès?

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1 minute ago, Neville Facking Bartos said:

Probably why he kept getting caught wrong side last night, not impressed by him so far 

He's even done a shift at CB (don't tell Moore)... But that could lend him to playing the role Luongo did under Monk where he dropped back to make a three out of possession.

He won't tho.

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7 minutes ago, Neville Facking Bartos said:

Probably why he kept getting caught wrong side last night, not impressed by him so far 

He worried me after his first booking that he wouldn't shut up at the ref and was a walking red.....hard to judge him so far.

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56 minutes ago, HappyOwl said:

On a positive note hats off to whoever did the owlsonline Twitter feed last night. Kept me well informed although I did go to bed as it went 2-0.

Never had need to use it before so thank you 🙌🙌🙌🙌

Thanks pal. Appreciate the feedback. It was I. 

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6 hours ago, mkowlthesexynewversion said:

 

He continues to come second in the tactical battles against other managers. 

Apart from the 4 other games this season that we haven't lost but yeah continues to come second 

Moore still far from convinces me but this is a ridiculous narrative 

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8 minutes ago, Andyben said:

But we'd have central defendes playing in their natural roles, knowing who to pick up and where,  we're always gonna concede crosses that's not the issue

It is part of the issue. Reduce the supply, reduce the threat.

Sow isn’t good enough for a start for me. I’d rather push Windass up to support Gregory. We need legs in midfield with Adeniran and FDB and Vaulks or Byers willing to get a foot in.

All a load of shite anyway cos no way will DM move from a back 3 unless injuries force it but Iorfa has not got a clue how to play as a 3 and Johnson is getting targeted as a weak left wing back defensively.

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Obviously we have a problem defending crosses, especially from our left, but 4me there is clearly other problems. How many chances have we actually created in last 3 league games? Hardly any. Take away the first half v Pompey and tbf,  first maybe 30 yesterday we've been poor, and frankly boring. 

Were desperate for some pace and flair up top. Someone who can stretch defences, and gives us an option 

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Is Jamie Smith part of the problem?

I used to like him, but I found his reaction very strange. He can't expect the player to be happy to be substituded. 
Why did he follow Byers and make such a fuss around it?

Today it's the first time ever that I wonder, if DM may need another assistant? They've been working together for 10 years - time for a change? Sorry, if that sounds harsh.

I am really pleased, that our players are currently all eager to be on the pitch. Byers only reacted to Smith's actions. I'm only watching on ifollow. What is your opinion about Smith and his relationship to the players (you see more of it live in the stadium).

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It could well be that Smith thought that Byers was disrespecting the decision of the manager, so was sticking up for him. 

For me its all a storm blown up out of nothing really, it happens more than people realise, but then people are big enough to move on. And I hope we can too.

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1 hour ago, Laceups said:

It is part of the issue. Reduce the supply, reduce the threat.

Sow isn’t good enough for a start for me. I’d rather push Windass up to support Gregory. We need legs in midfield with Adeniran and FDB and Vaulks or Byers willing to get a foot in.

All a load of shite anyway cos no way will DM move from a back 3 unless injuries force it but Iorfa has not got a clue how to play as a 3 and Johnson is getting targeted as a weak left wing back defensively.

Palmer would be a more defensive full back than Neymarv.

Vaulks and Byers would drop in and cover the overlap respectively.

Every **** would know his job. His space. I'll check the numbers but don't think we're conceding anymore crosses from the  left just have an abject inability to defend them sue to poor positioning 

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4 minutes ago, HoylandOwl said:

It could well be that Smith thought that Byers was disrespecting the decision of the manager, so was sticking up for him. 

For me its all a storm blown up out of nothing really, it happens more than people realise, but then people are big enough to move on. And I hope we can too.

Moore disrespected Byers.

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18 hours ago, JBO said:

Apart from the 4 other games this season that we haven't lost but yeah continues to come second 

Moore still far from convinces me but this is a ridiculous narrative 

Misinterpretation of the point i was making. I am referring to several key games over the period of Moore's tenure when he has lost out tactically to other managers. So yep we can flat track bully a few teams, but what was noticeable in our last 2 defeats is our managers in Maccan and Neil at Sunderland have out thought him. Or I see it he doesn't really seem to know how to combat it during the match.

Take Tuesday, if they are targeting the right hand side, why not go 4 4 1 to try and frustrate them.

My over-riding point, do we want to get promoted ? I am not convinced that Moore as that je ne sais que to do that. 

You get promoted by turning tight games into 3 points, clawing back draws from defeats when you have adversity of a red card

My issue with Tuesday was a very rushed plan to take off Byers - with HT so close anyway and then no urgency to address the situation at 1 down.

Evidence as I am saying about making key calls correctly at pivotal times that cumulatively limit our chances of promotion.

 

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The undercurrent of disliking for Moore has never really gone away. And the result on Tuesday just brought it bubbling back to the fore for many. Last season, around October IIRC, I voiced my dissatisfaction around the job he was doing so yes, I’ve not been a fan. 

However, post Xmas, (playoffs aside) I thought he did well, the results were there we were largely scoring and well, it almost happened. But, the issues always remained during that time. Conceding crap goals, either from simple crosses, set pieces or late goals.

We’ve not yet conceded from set pieces, or late on this season but the crap, easy goals with poor defending are still there, so it doesn’t surprise me the nay sayers are back, and quite loud. let’s be honest, they started coming back (wrongly IMO) against Charlton at half time with the boos. 
DM doesn’t help himself, his decision making SEEMS erratic at times when it comes to team selection. Part of me thinks, with the subs this season allowed, that tinkering may well be what we see across the board now, but he did it last season. 

I don’t want us to constantly be chopping and changing, having the players needing time to get used to a new system/manager etc.  Suppose we’ll see what happens, I want DM to be a success, I really do, because then we succeed. But…. I have my reservations.

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